Rebranding for Startups: A Mini-Lesson (Whys, hows, and ROI of rebranding) | Sofie Lehrmann, Founder, MilkMoo, fCMO

This transcript has been lightly edited for brevity. 

Mita Mandawker (00:02):

Sofie, I have, like one very interesting question I would say that has been bugging me ever since I saw this on your profile and ever since I've even had our conversation, and that was on rebranding. So I was chatting with a friend recently and were talking about rebranding and he was not really convinced about, you know, why do companies spend money on rebranding and that money could better spent in doing something else. And I realized that a lot of folks are not really aware of how rebranding works. Why, how and how is it even connected to like the ROI at a marketing level? Because startup marketers, we always tend to think of, you know, monies. We want to show where we get the bang for buck. 

Mita Mandawker (00:49):

And rebranding exercises for most marketers don't tend to get, you know, bucketed in that, you know, will be able to show like a proper ROI kind of a thing. So considering the fact that you've worked on so many rebranding exercises and you've done it for B2B companies, and I believe even B2C companies, I'm not really sure about that. Would love to hear about, you know, how do you approach a rebranding exercise and give some real world examples that would, you know, help audience understand about it? 

Sofie Lehrmann (01:20):

Yes, yes, rebranding. Oh, gosh, it's the question about rebranding. Always start with, you know, what's the reason why it would be good for business to rebrand? So there's several reasons why companies decide to rebrand. One of the bigger ones is mergers. When you need to have like one identity, you know, a new culture and new positioning on the market. But for tech startups of rebranding, it's often when you know, in the startups, they, you know, they start up between friends, they need a landing page, they do it quickly. They don't even do it consciously. They just need to have something on their website. And as time evolves, customers, they evolve, the market evolve, the company evolves. So it's not the same as it was when you started out. 

Sofie Lehrmann (02:33):

You know, your offerings, your value proposition, even your culture, you know, the values and the services that you provide. That's where a rebranding is needed. Other examples is like, you know, like when internally, like 15 different sales stakes are flying around, you know, pricing models are like, you know, depends. There's no consistency because the market is evolving so quickly. But there, you know, value proposition, their processes and so on, their visuals are still the same, not the same in terms of like, oh, they're using the same logo or the same colors. That's not what I mean. So for tech startups and for B2B startups, that's when you have that gap between before and now, right? Mergers, obviously, but they can also be like a refresh. 

Sofie Lehrmann (03:38):

Just visually, you know, again, goes back to, oh, it's outdated, you know, the whole visual part, it no longer represent us. We need to modernize a bit. And then there's different ways of doing rebranding. You can do a total overhaul, you know, where you are breaking everything to rebuild it, Meaning you're rebuilding the logo, you're rebuilding the colors, the visuals, even the value proposition, your messaging, you know, products. But that's often also one of the reasons that you have more products on the market. You know, it's no longer just your little, you know, your little MVP anymore. So, yeah, that's, that's, you know, what I have worked with mostly overhauls. 

Sofie Lehrmann (04:36):

I've also worked on adjustment, brand adjustments, you know, where you work on the branding side of things, the rebranding, just in terms of messaging, you adapt, you change the color a little bit, but not too much. So it's still like the same old visuals, you tweak it, right? So, you know, that's another way of doing it. Then you have the, you know, the visual reboot where you're only focusing on, you know, the external part. But that I would not recommend most of the time because when you change something in the colors, it's often because there's something on a deeper level that have, that has changed, you know, like the messaging or the value proposition that needs to reflect or more modern approach in the design. 

Sofie Lehrmann (05:36):

So whenever I have those conversations with rebranding, it's always around, you know, what's the reason for you to rebrand? Is it just because you want to modernize? Is it because your product has changed? Is it because your customers has changed? You know, and how do I approach the rebranding? The discussion, obviously, around the reasoning, deciding, are we only talking on the visual level or are we talking about the total overhaul? And most of the time, in the conversations that I've been having and on the projects that I've been having, most of the time, it's the total overhaul that is needed. Why? Because the startups, they started out, as I mentioned, at the start, as friends, they did, you know, frantically put something together in the start, and they came up with this great product with a very shitty brand. 

Sofie Lehrmann (06:37):

How credible Is that in the market, we have the most innovative products, you know, we are next generation, blah, but we have no consistency around our brand. We have a shitty website, you know, we have no consistency. When we showcase our sales decks, we have 10 different ways of pitching who we are, what we do, and where we do it and how we do it. You know, that's what the rebranding does, is that they combine all of those different gaps and align and strategize around the core of the company. Like, why are we unique? Who are our customers? What's the values that we have in the company? What's the personality that we want to showcase? What's the tone of voice? You know, what's the value proposition? What's the. What's the desired positioning we want to have in the market? 

Sofie Lehrmann (07:52):

So it's back to basics work, starting with the core. Once the CEO has decided that the numbers are down, sales are down, or that we are no longer what were five or six years ago. A commitment to a new version of themselves, right? And making them understand how that obviously can impact the bottom line. And bottom line is also reputation. It's not just, oh, I had 1,000 leads with 10% conversion rate. So how do you do rebranding? Well, you start with basics. You start with making an audit of the current status quo at the company. How are they perceived today by their customers? Why did they choose the company? Why do they think they're different? So having conversations and surveys with customers, but also internally with the employees, how are they seeing the, you know, the company, how are they seeing it evolving? 

Sofie Lehrmann (09:25):

What do they think are the values in the company that are driving success today, that are driving the way that we show up for our customers? So, you know, making a bigger audit and a bigger market research around customers and your internal people. And then from there you make top line messaging, Right? Top line messaging. You make positioning modeling in terms of. This is how we are different from the, you know, from the competitors. Those are our strong advantages in the market. We will be playing on this and this is how it will come out in the messaging. I was a bit quick on saying messaging, but this is. This is creating the core of the brand, you know, like how we perceived. Who are we today? What do we have that is different from, you know, from the competition? 

Sofie Lehrmann (10:32):

So it's basically who, what, and how, you know, but how. I would actually say that's more over to the external part of the brand, like the visual. How are we showing up as? Who are we showing up as this modern, simple way of being? That obviously needs to be conveyed in the design, in the tone of voice. So that's the second part of the brand work, which is that you sign and start to conceptualize the core. Once you have done that and you get acceptance, and you get validation from the artistic direction that you're taking based on the core, then you dive into all the deeper levels. You can even do it in parallel, because once you have the top-line messaging and issues and customer profiles validated, you can in parallel start working on your copy for the different channels that you have. 

Sofie Lehrmann (11:45):

So, the website is king in B2B marketing. And that's such a hard job. The whole content aspect of a rebranding, gosh, because you have to reassess all of the new products. The value proposition needs to be all over the place. Not all over the place, but it needs to be. Have the red thread across the board. And, you know, it definitely takes a lot of time. And you need to hire very good content marketers, obviously, a good agency too, or freelancers, which is not that expensive today. You can get a really good job, you know, for the design that doesn't need to cost like, you know, 30 or 40K. As long as your core is strong, that's fine. 

Sofie Lehrmann (12:54):

And you have someone who can interpret that core and, you know, conceptualize it, then you can find reasonable prices. So, yes, then you do the whole copy thing, messaging, and content, and then you get the validation obviously from the C suite, and then you start to put it into wireframes. You know, you make an MVP for the website, which is most often the, you know, the, centerpiece that, you know, have legs to other deliverables and channels. So you execute, you put it, you structure it, and then once that is validated, then you start working on the launch. Well, you actually start to do that from the, you know, much more earlier. But that's the, like, you know, that's the roughly, you know, I've given you those steps, like, roughly then you have the launch and the whole activation part. 

Sofie Lehrmann (14:09):

And when I say launch, I also mean internal launch, the soft launch. Your people in the company, you know, they are the ones who will carry your new brand and activate it in the market. They are the first ones who should see your new brand. And when I say brand, I don't mean logo and, you know, the new colors, but it's the whole damn thing. It's the vision, the mission, who we are, the values, our value proposition, and the positioning statement. They are the ones who deserve to see it first and the ones who should see it first. You need to train them. If it's a bigger rebranding project with a huge impact on how they interact with customers, then you need to train them beforehand. So that's what I call the Solve launch. And then you need to activate it, you know, externally. 

Sofie Lehrmann (15:16):

PR sent obviously to clients first. Make brand campaigns around this new brand. Everyone in the company communicates it on social media. And then you measure, obviously, then you measure, and you evolve. And you keep evolving the brand as you go along. Like, you tweak the messaging. You might maybe get some feedback around from clients saying, you know, I really, you know, that I don't really like, or that's not correct. And then you correct it. One thing that I failed to mention is that. But most companies don't do it, is that once you have that MVP of your new rebrand concretely put into, like, you know, like a website, for example, it's always a good idea to have four to six key customers give their feedback on it before it hits the market. 

Sofie Lehrmann (16:31):

So to your point, when we talked about customer centricity, it's the same here, you know, always check with the customer. Is this, Is this how you see us? Because it's all about the perception, the customer perception. Right. We can put things in place on how we would like to be perceived, and if that happens to be perceived the same way, you know, from our customers, then we did a really good job. And it can also sometimes help, you know, to nurture or to expand the perception that they have of a company with a new rebranding leading to clarity. Clarity is very important. Clarity around messaging, but also consistency in making a very recognizable unit of your company. And rebranding requires very, very strict planning.

Sofie Lehrmann (17:53):

It's such a huge project for a company because it doesn't only evolve the company, you know, no, sorry. The marketing department, it touches everyone in the company. And that's why most founders, they postpone it and like, oh, no, it's. It's like this huge transformation going on. No, we can't do this. And, you know, let's just, you know, let's just. It's good enough as it is right now. We have clients, you know, but the question is, like, we still have clients and, you know, we can make it work. We don't need more. Well, okay, in that case, then okay, then, you know, don't do the rebranding. But you can also get more clients if you do the rebranding correctly with a more clear messaging. 

Sofie Lehrmann (18:44):

Everyone having one voice in the market, you know, with how we pitch ourselves, how we show up, how we talk, how we treat our customers, what products we put up front. So having that very cohesive and consistent approach to the business is something that will help differentiate, you know, the company on the long term and be recognizable and create brand preference later on because it creates trust and credibility in the market. So different projects that I worked on. So I worked for total overhaul for a company a couple of years ago and I had the chance to see and measure it as well. And over that, you know, after that overhaul, the next six months, there was an increase around 35% in conversion rate on the, on the website, that's one thing. 

Sofie Lehrmann (19:55):

But also a better internally aligned approach in terms of how we talk with customers. So bigger customer satisfaction, but also employee satisfaction. So there was not so much fiction about, oh, why did you say this? Or I thought that this product had not yet been launched. So, creating more clarity. And I just finished another rebranding for a smaller startup, a total overhaul as well. So, messaging and visual identity as well. And they have received over the last three weeks after we launched six, seven quality leads and before they had none on the website, you know, but you know, that's very short term. Branding obviously goes beyond the websites. How do you show up with one voice, you know, across channels? How do you show up in the customer conversations, and how do we show up in customer support? It's the whole customer experience.

Sofie Lehrmann (21:17):

That's the, you know, that's the rebranding, you know, that you make the touch points consistent across the board, you know, and that you help create a memorable brand experience for people who matter. So, your customers, right? And many mistake branding and rebranding as just colors and logos. It's obviously much more than that. The brand it's who you are, how you're perceived, you know, how you show up, what, you know, what you do differently. That can be your product, your processes, your people. And then the decoration of the cake to make it very attractive and recognizable. That's the colors and you know, that's the logo. 

Mita Mandawker (22:22):

I don't think anyone could have explained what rebranding entails, what the types are, how people measure it, and what outcomes can be achieved. Well, thank you, Sofie. 

Sofie Lehrmann (22:35):

More complex than what I said, I tried to make it, you know, concise and short. It's a complex project, but you can take it as bites. You don't need to do the total overhaul. You can update it, and you can take a progressive approach to it. I know some friends who are doing a mini rebranding project, and they're starting just with the messaging in order not to scare off the C suite. Who doesn't want a huge investment sometimes, you know, until they do, until it's a necessity, you know. So my advice to marketers is to know your stuff around rebranding; that's one thing, but you can also take a step-by-step approach. Not like, oh, total transformation right away. You need to warm people up sometimes, especially the CEO and people in startups.

Sofie Lehrmann (23:41):

But when people come to me, that's mostly when they need the big overhaul because all the little nitty small stuff that was done over time didn't work, or it's outdated. 

Mita Mandawker (23:56):

Fair enough. I think this has been like a very fantastic mini-lesson on rebranding, and you broke it down really well. Like, I think this would be easily understandable for anyone, regardless of whether they are marketer or not. I think it was that easy. 

Sofie Lehrmann (24:17):

Great, thank you. Thank you.